Seq and AOL

[seqcleric]

I have everything installed correctly, my prob is this:

For some reason seq cannot sniff any of the adapters that i have on my machine. I am currently using AOL DSL as my isp. I have tried everything i can think of. Putting every adapter on the same network/subnet ect. It just wont work =/

If this is a common prob and anyone has a fix / idea's they will be much appretiated, thanks.

[BlueAdept]

Read the FAQ. It is answered there.

http://www.macsrule.com/~seqfaq/seq-faq.html#4.18

[seqcleric]

ty i found that, but didnt know if it was truly my problem. Thanks for the help :)

[BlueAdept]

Most DSL is usually either PPOE or PPOA.

[seqcleric]

Well i got the router...

Its all hooked up, correctly. But now nothing works outside of AOL software. ie, i can browse the web within the aol software, but cannot use internet explorer, or everquest for that matter.

Linksys, told me to call aol, aol told me to call linksys.

So my other option is this:
You can also use a linux computer which is using PPPoE software on the DSL interface and normal ethernet on the internal network. Just be sure to keep that hub too. ( quote from faq )

Anyone point me in the right direction as how to do this?

Thanks

[fryfrog]

i hate to be a hooker, but let me offer you a few quotes:

"AOL: You're so easy to use, no wonder we're #1"
"AOL: We're so easy to use, no wonder there are so many retards on the internet"

anyway, it may not really be an option for you... but it sounds to me like aol gayness. try a real ISP if its an option, is there even any aol software for linux? i guess your only other option would be the much hated by the elite... a windows NAT box using something like NAT32 or ICS :)

[high_jeeves]

"AOL: You're so easy to use, no wonder we're #1"
"AOL: We're so easy to use, no wonder there are so many retards on the internet"


Sorry, I always jump on people for this one. The bottom line is, without services such as AOL/Prodigy/CompuServe/QuantumLink in the early days of online, YOU probably wouldnt be on the internet right now. (does anyone but me remeber QuantumLink for the C64?)

The vast majority of people who are "l33t" now are only there because the internet became extremely popular. How do you think that would have happened with the initial low cost, easy to use services?

Granted, for somebody who is looking for power internet, AOL is not the service for you.. I personally havnt used it in about 8 years, because it doesnt fit my needs. But calling all AOL users retards is about the same to me as calling all windows users retards. Anyone who cant see that the best application is the one that works for your needs is a retard. My grandmother uses AOL regularly... why? because she wants to do 3 things: email, IM, check the news sometimes. She doesnt want to deal with 4 programs to do these 4 things (a dialer, browser, messenger, and email client). AOL is the perfect application for her. If she was trying to do packet sniffing, download MP3s, or check out the latest pr0n, then I would probably recommend a different service for her.



Well i got the router...

Its all hooked up, correctly. But now nothing works outside of AOL software. ie, i can browse the web within the aol software, but cannot use internet explorer, or everquest for that matter.

Linksys, told me to call aol, aol told me to call linksys.

So my other option is this:
You can also use a linux computer which is using PPPoE software on the DSL interface and normal ethernet on the internal network. Just be sure to keep that hub too. ( quote from faq )

Anyone point me in the right direction as how to do this?

Thanks


I would strongly recommend that you do some searching before you buy more equipment that wont help you. I search on google for AOL DSL PPPOE, and found a number of articles/discussions relating to this issue... you will find them most enlightening..

--Jeeves

[BlueAdept]

Your network should look like this:




DSL
|
Router
|
--Hub-----
| |
SEQ EQ



DSL to the Router, then the hub plugged into the router and both EQ and SEQ machines plugged into the hub.

That should work unless AOL does something screwy with it. Make sure that it is a REAL hub and not a switch.

[Yueh]

QuantumLink for the C64


Hehe, I was grounded for three weeks for the bill I racked up on that forsaken service :)

[seqcleric]

ya ya i know, and yes it was my only option at the time. I went from T3 to this shit, it sucks.

There are other options now, cable, other dsl providers, but i am moving soon. Dont want to change isp's untill then.

Anyways, i am missing the hub in your diagram, is that a must? i tore the old one out and put the router in its place. If it needs to be there thats np hooking it up like that.

will try the hub, and let you know. Thanks for the help.

[seqcleric]

Put hub in, and nadda =/

I give up for today lol.

You win again, AOL. Damn you.

[BlueAdept]

Do both your linux box and your win box both have inet?

You sure it is a real hub? It might be a switch that says its a hub.

Try doing tcpdump and see if your linux box can see any packets from the windows machine.

[seqcleric]

Well i am pretty sure it is an active hub. It has power to it. a switch doesent, correct me if i am wrong. 90% sure its a hub.

The inet sharing program i have works for windows, but doesnt for linux. Its still on the network, because i can ping the router and eq machine. ( its a duelboot btw, win98se and linux ) it just has no proxy to go through for inet access.

No idea how to do a tcp dump, or where to look for packets on the linux box. To be competly honest i dont know linux at all. And i mean at all, my brother installed it. i can boot it up and run showeq lol

I will go look for info on this [tcpdump] you speak of.

[Mr. Suspicious]

Why don't you follow High Jeeves' advice? I did as he suggested and I'm pretty sure you will be helped faster and learn more about your problem by doing as he suggested then playing the "guess/try/perhaps/dunno, might try/could be" game.

http://www.google.com : "AOL DSL PPPOE"

[seqcleric]

How do you know i didnt already search? You dont.

What answers to my problem do you expect me to find there? How to share the connection with my aol software and linksys router? I have done that on my own, and its working properly. Does this information help me with linux? no.

It still doesnt tell me why linux is not deciphering the PPPoE packets. This is why im asking for more brain power here. I'ts not like im asking the obvious.

If you feel my questions are a waste of your time, Mr Suspicious, you dont have to try and help.

Blue, i found a program called winPcap, packet analizer. Trying to figure out how i actually intercept them or whatever with the linux box atm.

[high_jeeves]

winPcap stands for WINdows Packet CAPture.. not going to help you much on linux.. try following one of the many walkthroughs here, or following the FAQ.. it sounds like the remaining answers you need (how to check if its a hub or a switch, etc) are found there.

--Jeeves

[fryfrog]

so, let me see if i have something correct. even though you are using a linksys router, you still need to use some aol software on your windows box? that is very likely the problem. what you WANT to happen is that the linksys device (or what ever your gateway ends up being) to be taking care of all the logging in and authentication. behind the firewall, everything should be talking to eachother using plain old tcp/ip ethernet (what ever) and NOT being going through some software (sounds like maybe aol alters the packets by using pppoe or something else). have you setup your linksys router to login with a user/pass? i think most of them have that options some where.

[seqcleric]

You gotta love aol. They only way they would let linksys use the router with thier software is this:

http://linksys.com/support/support.asp?spid=100

So technicaly, yes, i do want the router to authenticate for me. But oh no aol couldnt have that, then the shitty software would be bypassed. Instead you log on the router as some generic log in aol set up for linksys, only as some sort of gateway for the software to authenticate.

I am changing ISP's to another DSL provider, that is the only solution it seems. Though i still wanted to solve the problem/bypass the aol software, just for spite. Its next to immpossible, unless someone can find the address for the proxy server.

Thanks for the help though, once my isp is changed it will work fine.

[Yueh]

It probably isn't the only solution but it is most certainly the preferred one :D While AOL may have done a huge amount for the Internet's success you can only take their customer manipulation for so long.

[fryfrog]

probably the easiest (and best too) solution would be to just make a windows box using ICS be your gateway.

[seqcleric]

So on to the big question, can the software be bypassed?
I have never heard of anyone getting around it.

I did a tracert to the aol dns server, it didnt give me any ip's usable as a proxy. i'm probably off in left field. I'm going to continuosly work on this untill my isp changes. If i find out how to do it, i'll be sure to post. Likelyhood of me being able to do it is slim to none, but its worth a shot.

I thought about making the windows box btw, i just dont have the space for it. Got another machine though lol :/

[fryfrog]

at least you do have the option of another isp. i won't knock what the big isp's have done for getting people on the net and making it popular, but i wouldn't want them as an isp. i have a friend who is basically trapped on aol dialup because they can't take the email address change, but they can't afford to have both aol and dsl/cable active at the same time... sucks to be them.

aol/prodigy/what ever are great for beginners, but at some point they start to limit you far more than they help. especially the ones with propriatary software, dialers, etc...

[Yueh]

OT but, AOL used to have an option to just use their system without using them as an ISP. Was something like $10 a month. If you really want your aol email addy that is an option. Course, for $10 a month, you can just get your own domain these days :)

[fryfrog]

yeah, i actually told them about that. they are a teacher, and all their students and past students have the aol address. i would hope that they would just do the $10/mo thing w/o aol dial up... but who knows what teachers can afford and can't.

i would cry trying to play 4 accounts setup behind a nat dialup... let a lone 4 accounts on a nat aol dialup ;)

[Yueh]

Does that work! If it does, kudo's to Verant's networking coders :)

[high_jeeves]

i have a friend who is basically trapped on aol dialup because they can't take the email address change, but they can't afford to have both aol and dsl/cable active at the same time... sucks to be them.

But that is true with almost every ISP on the planet... I currently use roadrunner.. If I decide to switch to another service (or, even move to another city) I have to change email addresses... That is just the way ISPs work.. sure, some will do forwarding for you, but the vast majority wont.. I think its kindof silly to blame this on AOL. Lets say they instead had the $9.95 localdialup.com, and wanted to switch.. they would have the exact same problem!

--Jeeves

[fryfrog]

i wasn't really critizing(sp?) aol's email policy. i am not stupid to the way email works. in fact, i have not used my own isp's email for 5 or 6 years because i know it changes. i use hotmail... it may be full of spam, but it hasn't changed in ... damn, well a long time.

what i was saying was that they had a reason for needing to keep their @aol.com email address. and that they also had a hard time playing eq because of aol's software. turned out that downgrading or upgrading to their beta helped resolve the issue... but, its still not an ideal connection for playing everquest.

i don't want to get into some big ass philisophical argument over how aol (and big isps) are evil or not evil, i'm just saying they have their place. some of their strong suits are providing custom content, a half decent internet connection and maybe some sort of parental control. what they don't provide is an ideal connection for gaming, be it over dial up or broadband. there are better options for THIS sort of usage than aol. by all means, if your family and kids need some place to get help with homework... if you need to browse the web lightly (and don't mind that some sites might be blocked/censored) use aol/prodigy/etc... but if you need it for other things, choose your isp for what you are going to do :)

aol is good for your grandparents, aunts and uncles who don't know about computers.
not using aol is for the people that know how to use their computers pretty well and don't need the hand holding. (or don't have some legacy reasong for using aol) ;)

[STiLE]

Summing everything up for this post:

AoL aka GayOL and AoHell is the devil.

Computers dont like it and never have. Hell a friend of mine had it on for 3 days no more no less and on the third day his box wouldnt boot properly until he took it off. Whee! Get rid of that crappy software.