No Skittles

[e@tme]

Well...

No Patch > No SEQ > No skittles. /

click here (http://eqlive.station.sony.com/support/scheduled_downtime.jsp)

[BinaryConfusion]

anyone wonder if they (Sony) are doing this to prevent the devs from releasing the fix ?

[e@tme]

no not really.

The devs will release something when they see fit.

[Dedpoet]

Heh. "We are going to fix monks! Haha, April Fools!"

Bastards.

[Jel321]

You guys on live dont want this patch yet anyway...trust me ;)

[Alfred]

Care to breakdown the changes for good and ill that you have noticed on the test server code? Please. :)

(besides it will give us a break from the other normal flaming threads)

;)

[Fantastik]

Doesn't take a mensa to figure this one out. Patch was obviously never meant to go out today. Scheduling a patch on april fools? Really. I'd be surprised if they ever release a client with the test network changes.

Actually, thats not true. If I was them, I'd not release it till someone goes ahead and cracks the current live implementation. THEN I would release it to frustrate the programmers. I would then alter the encryption on test, and push a patch through the following week thus invalidating the current patch.

I'd bet all the tea in China this has been thier game plan. Only makes sense. Its been working great too. SEQ has been disabled for near 2 months now... longer than ever before.

What I'm REALLY curious about is how they plan to fight the apps that rip skittle info out of EQ in the windows side. Thats the fun one to prevent.

[Amadeus]

I doubt seriously that the decision to patch or not has anything to do with SEQ ..hehe

[Alwayslost]

Actually, if you think about it, SOE HAS done much recently to greatly reduce the numbers of SEQ users.

1) Added in game mapping (stole from SEQ)
2) Fixed a BIG lag issue that also included new encryption (unfortunately borked SEQ in the process)
3) Added in a windowing feature and Pardoned WinEQ bannings


I'm not in any way saying SEQ is dead or complaining about the current functionality, I'm merely pointing out that those of us that are still here are the diehard and demented. (which explains some of the posts)

As usual, thanks to all the folks that push the code, MUCH appreciated!

[Fantastik]

Originally posted by Amadeus
I doubt seriously that the decision to patch or not has anything to do with SEQ ..hehe

Why not? its common knowledge that after a patch to get EQ working there are over 50 thousand access to cvs. Thats ALOT of users. I can easily see SOE doing this on purpose. They already publicly said that encryption was added for the sole purposes of messing up SEQ.

Its much easier for them to delay or not patch than to change or add encryption. So its a valid scheme.

[jbarrio5]

SEQ users have been cheating for years, and yet the game managed to go on. The general game economics where not really affected.
If you had SEQ, you could always spot other SEQ users in the game; you would see a mage that could obviously track a mob. But these encounters where extremely rare.
Out of the 50,000 supposedly SEQ users (I think they are a lot less), lets just say that they are 10,000 die hard SEQ fans, fans that will stop playing and cancel their subscription if they cant use SEQ. That’s over $100,000 a month.
EQ is a business, and they are in the business of making money, just as they would not risk having everybody be able to cheat because regular players would stop playing (and then stop paying), they are also aware of the fact that if they alienate this particular group of cheaters to much, they stand to loose quite a bit of money.
It also cost a lot of money to implement security measures geared to deter cheating, you can only go so far before it becomes unreasonable and to costly. To think that their developers are purposely withholding release dates of patches and changing encryption just to stop SEQ is really giving SEQ too much credit.
I have shown other EQ players SEQ, and it is just to expensive and complicated to implement for the average person, it involves money and time, two things most people don’t have a lot of, and Sony knows this.
So to all you paranoid SEQ users out there, neither Sony nor the government is out to get you. You can take the tinfoil off your head and stop using ultra undetectable key sniffers, there is no mass banning or men in black outside your door waiting to rifle through your computer.

[Alwayslost]

Funny thing is that the BIGGER threat to the economy of EQ, both in game and RL is MacroQuest.

MQ + eBay = rent, new computers, new car, etc.

Yet everyone thinks SEQ is the bad guy.

[SlowNLazy]

Yeah... the men in black are too busy keeping the aliens among us in line and out of public knowledge.. Jeez.. don't ya watch the movies....

Cost of reading threads about the cost of EQ > Cost of SoE implementing security to thwart SEQ > Cost of letting a few people use SEQ ingame > Cost of actually setting up a SEQ box

Did that makes sense? Nah, but it did increase the first cost of the equation!

[Dedpoet]

2) Fixed a BIG lag issue that also included new encryption (unfortunately borked SEQ in the process)

That all depends on who you ask. I hear it's great on large raids, but have you tried to chase a single mob down in an outdoor zone since LoY? They warp so bad you look like an airforce pilot in evasive maneuvers trying to catch it.

Something in LoY also severely screwed up video on my secondary box that has an original Radeon (7200) card in it. No matter what settings I try I get horrible video lag, even on the character select screen. My bot often falls off of autofollow due to video lag and it's practically unplayable if you try to do anything except bot. My laptop displays EQ better. No hardware, driver, or settings changes on my end, and my main box with the GF4 is the same as ever. *sigh* I guess I need to drop another $130 for a low end GF4 to play a game with 4 year old graphics since my 2 year old graphics card is now useless.

Sorry, </rant>

[Poncho]

I'd put the regular usage of SEQ WAY under that 10,000 mark. Really dont think there are over a couple thousand overall, esp after adding sniffers. I'd even be willing to put those numbers in the hundreds (My opinion of course). I'm Sure Ratt could give some breakdowns of board usage; but really no use. Do we really think there are that many users out there that never look at this forum? I would think not.

Yes, SOE is about making money. Killing SEQ isnt going to kill their memberbase that much. Comparitively, killing SEQ isnt going to make it grow either. Looking at the whole picture, I think we are seeing the fundamentals of programers in action. It's more of an ego thing really. Why not show you can fix things like lag AND show the programmers/followers of SEQ that you are one step ahead of them also? Hell, if I worked for SOE, I'd do it for shits and giggles just because I could.

We have to remember, there are great programmers/coders on both sides of the fence, problem is, one side is getting paid and the other isnt. Kinda falls under the "no-shit" category.

Also, following the history of "new" CVS updates, it's always a clusterfuck of "why cant i get the new CVS to work" posts, or why cant I get this or that to compile....does anyone here honestly think the coders of this project want to go through this when they release new updates every 2 weeks just to make others happy?

Hell, if we wait long enough, maybe some will give up and leave for good. (I know the power of positive thinking) Judging by some of the posts in these forums, I cringe at the fact some of these people playing the game in the first place, or even breeding for that matter.

-Poncho

[Alfred]

Want to solve that the issue of how many people actually use it? lol

For the next fix put in a very small HARMLESS piece of code that sends a packet that gives a unique number. It would be sent to a small server to tally the results.

This can be an ultra random number generated the first time the new code is run and then stored on the drive. Heck, just send the number one time and if the file exists don't send it again. There are ways to make certain you get a 99% random number. ;)

We could then have the answer to how many people really use it :)

hehe

[e@tme]

Its real simple and easy to do the math on how many people use SEQ..

Just take a leaf out of Douglas's Book and voila...

(ps. first one to come up with the answer gets a free issue of SEQ :p)

[Poncho]

I can see it now....

"Alfred leads SEQ's next revolt!!"

Can you imagine the panic of an embedded worm? ick!

I still dont think numbers really matter that much for the overall picture. I mean really, will getting rid of SEQ really help make SOE any more money? I doubt it. Will keeping SEQ around help them from losing a "tad" bit of money (read: a few disgruntled accounts)? Probably. So whats the point? I'll stick with "coder ego"...just because they can

-Poncho

[Alfred]

Originally posted by Poncho
I can see it now....

"Alfred leads SEQ's next revolt!!"

Can you imagine the panic of an embedded worm? ick!


Unless the meaning has changed, I don't think that qualifies as a worm. ;)

Besides... the joy of open source right? You can verify that it is harmless before doing a make. :eek:

lol Oh well. Just another wet dream that will fade away before...

[Jaerin]

Originally posted by e@tme
Its real simple and easy to do the math on how many people use SEQ..

Just take a leaf out of Douglas's Book and voila...

(ps. first one to come up with the answer gets a free issue of SEQ :p)

42

[Lyroschen]

What is 6 times 7?

[e@tme]

Gratz to Jaerin!!

Click here (http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=10131) for your well earned prize.

[datadog]

Originally posted by Alfred
For the next fix put in a very small HARMLESS piece of code that sends a packet that gives a unique number. It would be sent to a small server to tally the results.

I crown this the king of BAD IDEAS!

I dont want my SEQ box transmitting anything to anyone.. ever... and it wont. Being open source, not only can i inspect such code, but I can disable it too...

Besides, what good can come from knowing how many are actually successfully running SEQ? Who needs this info?

[Alfred]

pfft

Gezz you are absolutely no fun.

I forgot that the black copters that nobody can hear are just outside our homes (Opps I mean bunkers) and that the Man is watching me type this right now.

What good? Well that really depends. If the person who runs the server (such as Ratt) deems the information is dangerous, he doesn't tell anyone. :p or he makes up a lie and only if you have the super duper secret handshake that the Man doesn't know about will you learn it. :p

(*** wonders where he can get away from the people looking over their shoulder every two seconds ***)

[who_me_use_seq]

Alfred,
I don't know why you feel the need to know how many SEQ users there are out there. Whatever that reason may be I would think that you could see that a group of people who are using a utility that could get them banned from an activity that they all waste waaaaaaaay too much time on, and who are, moreover ........shall we say........ acutely aware of security exploits and what can be done with them, is not going to be your best market for a "harmless" bit of identity reporting code.

Plus I know that some of the more paranoid among us :D (remember: Just because you are paranoid doesn't mean that they are not out to get you.):D have gone so far as to connect our Linux boxes to our networks with the transmit pair on the patch cord snipped. (airgap security)

[Alfred]

Originally posted by who_me_use_seq
Alfred,
I don't know why you feel the need to know how many SEQ users there are out there. Whatever that reason may be I would think that you could see that a group of people who are using a utility that could get them banned from an activity that they all waste waaaaaaaay too much time on, and who are, moreover ........shall we say........ acutely aware of security exploits and what can be done with them, is not going to be your best market for a "harmless" bit of identity reporting code.

Plus I know that some of the more paranoid among us :D (remember: Just because you are paranoid doesn't mean that they are not out to get you.):D have gone so far as to connect our Linux boxes to our networks with the transmit pair on the patch cord snipped. (airgap security)


*** Makes copter sounds in the night ***

well actually I made the comment because someone else asked the question earlier. ;) Nothing quite like reading the tail end of a thread is there hehe.

[Lyroschen]

Bah, I live next to a military base so I hear choppers all the time. It's mostly the choppers you can't hear that you should be worried about.

[bones]

Just sayin there are quite a few of people that know that are using this. How many dont I know?

[Lyroschen]

You and your friends are the only ones actually using SEQ. The rest of us are just here for the company, and to see what you troublemakers are up to.

[who_me_use_seq]

That is correct. I personally find the conversations on this board to be charming and enlightening. I know nothing of this "ShowEQ" of which you speak.

[LordCrush]

ShowEQ whats that ?

[Lyroschen]

ShowEQ is a Top Secret government sattelite spy app. It stands for Sattelites Hovering Over Washington Eavesdropping Quietly. Or just Sattelites Eavesdropping Quietly for those who say SEQ.

It's been mentioned that users of SEQ can spy on individuals in their immediate area, even to the point of displaying multi-colored dots on a map representing everyone in the vacinity. It's these dots folks refer to when they say "Skittles". Folks can get very detailed information about you using SEQ.

Such information includes, but is not limited to (lawyers require this disclaimer):

- Your name
- Relative experience
- Occuptation
- Position and direction (even how high off the ground you are).
- What you're carrying (very useful to local gangs looking for phat lewts)
- Religion (if any)
- Gang affiliations
- Species (mostly for those living in Arkansas, but works everywhere)
- Any pets you have

and much much more...

The Sattelite Operator Extraordinairre (SOE) has recently been preventing casual use of SEQ; increasing security to keep all of this spy information for themselves. That's 'cause they're evil.

Hope this helps. \\=^ )

[cavemanbob]

Yeah well myseq works atm :p and it even works in windows....

I'm expecting the black chopers at any any moment hehe

[LordCrush]

Folks can get very detailed information about you using SEQ

...

- Your name
- Relative experience
- Occuptation
- Position and direction (even how high off the ground you are).
- What you're carrying (very useful to local gangs looking for phat lewts)
- Religion (if any)
- Gang affiliations
- Species (mostly for those living in Arkansas, but works everywhere)
- Any pets you have



Rofl